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 #18 Re: understanding the difference in boards? 28/04/2008 @ 16:16:35 |
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| In reply to post #16 ... |
| Depends on what freestyle it's aimed at. Most kicker/pipe boards will be reasonably stiff to allow them to power up the walls or stomp the landing cleanly. They don't want something that's soft and is possibly going to wash on landing. Jib sticks for rails and general messing about obviously tend to be soft. |
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Mountain Surf Bandit
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| #17 Re: understanding the difference in boards? 27/04/2008 @ 22:56:01 |
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| In reply to post #16 ... |
| Burtons own website stats that its an all mountain freestyle board, maybe everyone at burton are 'tards' then |
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| Ranked Posts: 361 |
| UK - Northern Ireland |
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| #16 Re: understanding the difference in boards? 27/04/2008 @ 18:06:05 |
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| In reply to post #2 ... |
| if they claim the royale to be a freestyle board theyre a pile of tards. i tried a mate of mines royale in verbier, and it was horrible, one of the stiffest boards ive ever ridden and dead twitchy, although his edges always seemed to be ridiculously sharp even after weeks with no servicing :S |
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BASI Level 2 Snowboard Instructor
'To do a dangerous thing with style is what I call art' - Charles Bukowski |
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| #15 Re: understanding the difference in boards? 26/04/2008 @ 23:50:29 |
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Stones are British too :p Not sure why, always weighed myself in stones. Anyway 62kg is about 10 stone, 11 1/2 stone is about 73kg. Although that may not be how much I weighed, I don't weigh myself often! Given that the weight range for my board is 45-73kg it'll probably be a little less ridiculous in deeper snow now I weigh about 60  (another guess, I was 10 stone last time I weighed myself but I think I've lost more weight since). |
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| #14 Re: understanding the difference in boards? 26/04/2008 @ 21:29:47 |
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| In reply to post #12 ... |
There’s no doubt that a longer board will work better in powder and on some boards, you’re going to really struggle. At one point I was riding a 153 and although I would go off-piste on it, it sometimes felt like riding a shovel (I’m about 12st). These days I’m on a 160, which is generally fine for anything I come across in resort.
I’ve never been fortunate enough to go heli-boarding, but if I did, I think I’d bend my rule a bit and take along something that’s going to really get me the best out of it. |
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| Ranked Posts: 816 |
| UK - England |
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| #13 Re: understanding the difference in boards? 26/04/2008 @ 21:28:05 |
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| In reply to post #12 ... |
It does. Which we're not disagreeing on I think.
Float is especially important if you're riding "bottomless" powder, where you're working with the flotation of the board, rather than riding on the base of the stuff the powder may be on top of. Hence traditionally powder boards were always huge - I weigh 62Kgs; not sure what that is in American, but it's less that your weight, and my standard powder board was a 168. That was small for powder; until Fish boards you'd not see anyone in a heli on less. I spent a few years riding powder on piste boards before I saw the light, which may be why I'm trying to stop other people wasting time like that.
On powder boards specifically, I think it's the same as piste boards.... You just need to get a board which is the right length for you. Sure, you can ride anything down anything: so can I. But I know when I'm riding a board which works with me, as opposed to one which I have to deal with.
As far as turning... people often have trouble in the trees with really big boards - Dough Boys or Tankers and the like. I think that they shouldn't really, but then I've not actually tried a huge board in the trees, and for sure the 156 Fish is more squirrely than the 162 Malolo, so maybe length is a factor there.
If you're riding at resorts (on or off piste) then everything you're riding's going to have a base on it anyway. I don't use powder boards at resorts for that reason. There you need a piste board... it's surprising how few of them you actually see people riding really. |
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| #12 Re: understanding the difference in boards? 26/04/2008 @ 17:48:28 |
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Presumably in deep powder the surface area of the board (which is related to the length) does affect things though? As a bigger surface area = less pressure which means less sinking, all other things being equal (which I am aware they're not).
I dunno, I figured the short length of my board was at least part of the reason I sank like a stone in a foot of powder. Obviously it being a flexy park board with a centered stance and me lacking in skill were also factors, but when I borrowed a board that was a more suitable length for my weight for the conditions (I was about 11 1/2 stone at the time, riding a 152 and then borrowed a 157) the sinking problems were massively reduced! Although then I couldn't turn the bloody thing in the trees because it was confusingly long, again probably more to do with my lack of skills though. I'm hoping that it'll be a bit easier on the short board now I've lost a bunch of weight, guess I will find out at some point! |
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| Ranked Posts: 943 |
| Oxfordshire |
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| #11 Re: understanding the difference in boards? 26/04/2008 @ 12:35:54 |
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| In reply to post #10 ... |
QUOTE (philw - 26/04/2008 @ 10:27:54) I think it's all a question of what you mean by powder.
All v true but when anyboldy ever talks about riding pow they are talking about in a resort and normally not too far off the piste. Sure some people will get to ride what you describe but it's not an everyday thing and saying stuff like 'that board wont work in pow' will just confuse people more.
I can almost appreciate what you are saying but I still find it hard to see how you just cant make a turn because I've never ridden those conditions. I remember taking the wrong board out a couple of times when the snow has been really light and struggling, so I guess it's like that but magnified. |
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| Ranked Posts: 816 |
| UK - England |
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| #10 Re: understanding the difference in boards? 26/04/2008 @ 10:27:54 |
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| In reply to post #7 ... |
I think it's all a question of what you mean by powder.
Maybe I already posted the story about the chap who managed to BS his way onto a standby seat in a Wielege heli last season. He smuggled his jib board on there somehow and in the rush no one noticed. Until he tried to ride it through the waist-deep 5%. Not surprisingly he just couldn't turn at all. They allocated a tail-guide to him, who told me in the bar afterwards that she had to walk him down the 1,000 vertical meters of the run. That's through waist-deep powder - an exhausting and expensive morning for him. At least it was a baby warm-up run or there could have been more serous consequences.
This chap was a local, and confident enough to spend $1,200 on a day's heli. Probably he would be a strong rider at the park. You'd think he'd know better.
In the cats, it's a bit easier. The snow's not generally quite so deep and dry, and the runs are shorter. Generally we persuade people to use the right gear, but there are always a few who don't want to take advice. Until they see their mates and everyone else having fun on powder boards, at which point the BS disappears and we lend them a powder board. And not an ST, which are silly. |
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| #9 Re: understanding the difference in boards? 26/04/2008 @ 08:55:16 |
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| In reply to post #7 ... |
QUOTE (NickE - 25/04/2008 @ 14:33:52) . It’s not that I don’t think it would make a difference – it’s just I like to ride pretty much the same way whatever the conditions, e.g. even in powder, I like to ride switch a fair amount. Doesn’t really work on a swallow tail. 
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| Ranked Posts: 28 |
| Greater Manchester |
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| #8 Re: understanding the difference in boards? 25/04/2008 @ 20:36:14 |
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Thanks for that, I think it is a stiffness thing, and for general larking about on piste or slashing slush and fresh powder I just don't need the stiffness of the Palmer. Still I shall keep playing with it cos its all interesting stuff.
Cheers Rich |
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| An old fashioned sort of biscuit |
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| #7 Re: understanding the difference in boards? 25/04/2008 @ 14:33:52 |
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| In reply to post #5 ... |
QUOTE (philw - 25/04/2008 @ 11:31:46)  I can't really conceive riding both icy piste and over-the-head powder (the only types of snow I generally encounter) on one board, so I guess I'm more picky about this than you.
If you have high winds when it’s really cold and the first big dump in weeks, you can get both conditions on the same run (well, maybe the powder’s not over your head). You’d have to carry your spare board on your back.
Seriously, I know a lot of people like to use different boards for different things, but aside from the logistics, it doesn’t really do it for me. I don’t even change my binding set-up for powder days. It’s not that I don’t think it would make a difference – it’s just I like to ride pretty much the same way whatever the conditions, e.g. even in powder, I like to ride switch a fair amount. Doesn’t really work on a swallow tail. It’s just personal preference. I know this means I’m not necessarily getting the best out of all conditions, but you can't have it all. |
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| #6 Re: understanding the difference in boards? 25/04/2008 @ 11:46:57 |
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| In reply to post #5 ... |
QUOTE (philw - 25/04/2008 @ 11:31:46) I can't really conceive riding both icy piste and over-the-head powder (the only types of snow I generally encounter) on one board, so I guess I'm more picky about this than you.
Agree, everyone should have thier all mountain board + a Burton Fish!  |
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| Ranked Posts: 816 |
| UK - England |
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| #5 Re: understanding the difference in boards? 25/04/2008 @ 11:31:46 |
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| In reply to post #4 ... |
Fair points.
I'm not sure that buying in the uk is a good idea for many reasons in addition to the lack of representative demo space.
I hear what you're saying about the time to get used to a board, although I find that I can adjust pretty quickly, like switching cars, say. All you need to do is to figure out if the flex is right, and it's mostly a choice of two boards (ie "this one or the next one up"); you don't have to tweak your stance to do that. Just use a centred (on the inserts) stance and don't change your angles.
I also hear your point about "getting the right board". But then you do see a large number of people side slipping on what seems to be very unsuitable gear. I wonder how many of them give up the sport without ever enjoying the feeling you get from the right board. It's just that, well, when a board is right it's hugely better than when it's not; so much so that it really hits you. Instead of fighting the thing, you can forget about it.
I can't really conceive riding both icy piste and over-the-head powder (the only types of snow I generally encounter) on one board, so I guess I'm more picky about this than you. |
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| #4 Re: understanding the difference in boards? 25/04/2008 @ 10:09:30 |
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| In reply to post #3 ... |
It makes a lot of sense in theory to try out a whole range of stuff before you buy, but in practice I think this can be pretty difficult to do properly.
Most of us have to work on the basis of having a single board which we can take away with us, because it’s just not practical to transport a mass of kit. We therefore need something that’s going to work across a range of conditions, riding deep powder, carving up groomed piste, hitting kickers or just playing around. Any board is going to respond a bit differently to these, so you’d really need to try something out over quite a range of stuff. This is pretty difficult if you’re buying in the UK, as conditions in the domes are not really reflective of what you get on the mountain (let alone the dry slopes).
Even where you can test in the right conditions, I personally find it takes me quite a time to get used to the board. Although I’ve ridden quite a range of stuff over the years, I’ll only have one board at a time and I’ll use it for everything. If I try out something new it takes more than a few runs for me to adjust to it and that may involve changing round the binding settings as well, which then takes more time. Any new board feels weird at first until I have got used to it, but until I feel comfortabvle enough to really push it, I can’t be said to be testing it out.
Also, I think people can get overly hung up about getting just the right board. There are clearly boards that are more or less suitable, but most people can ride quite happily on a variety of boards without the need for them to be the perfect length, especially if you consider that they’re going to be better for different things.
I think what I’m trying to say is definitely try out if you can, but don’t get too worried about trying to find the perfect fit. |
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